Engineer readers see themselves as underpaid but stoical about it, according to our latest poll
We’ve rarely had such an emphatic response to a poll. Of the 591 readers who responded, two-thirds picked the option that engineers did not complain too much about pay and were not paid enough. Unfortunately, we can’t separate out whether respondents were agreeing with both parts of the statement or only one. Of the remaining respondents, 15 per cent thought that engineering salaries were good, 11 per cent agreed that complaining about pay levels was counterproductive, and only 4 per cent thought that an interesting and worthwhile job was an ample reward. Another four percent declined to pick an option.
Please continue to let us know your opinions on this subject, and if you have not, take a moment to complete our 2016 salary survey so that we can compile an accurate picture of engineering salaries in the various sectors and regions of the UK industry.
I’m no expert on bell curves, but if one-third complaining they are underpaid, they are probably right? As they’ll probably be in the lower third of a bell curve, which is centred around what is probably be an acceptable wage? My gut tells me it’s dangerous to compare a statistical cross-section with an average single figure, and try and make a story out of that. If you analyse the wages of just those 1/3 of engineers complaining, are they all lower than a reasonable figure for their age/experience/responsibility?
By the way, could not get the ONS link to work, I think you meant http://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/bulletins/annualsurveyofhoursandearnings/2014-11-19
Thanks Wendy, we’ve amended that.
Your poll misses the point. Before you can define whether Engineers are well paid you have to define what an Engineer is. Would you consider a CEng MIMechE who happens to be the CEO of a multi-national an Engineer? I know what I mean by a practising Engineer, I sometimes think your magazine does not.
Could we have a working ONS link? It doesn’t seem to work for me.
Pay in engineering has stagnated. We are not as highly prized as other professions that we work alongside, and unless you are directly associated with the money in business we never will.
“An interesting and worthwhile job is ample reward” Ha Ha,
Perhaps we should offer that as an option to Doctors, Nurses and the Police. How about to the Public servants?
to set the stage, I am not a currently practising engineer (in the traditional sense)
However, the number of people with engineering degrees & similar qualifications who are paid commensurately with other professionals (i.e. Doctors etc.) is fairly small – however, to Kris’s point above – the “real” money is generally only available to the bean-counter CxO level, and in this country, unlike those in the DACH region, those are rarely drawn from the technically competent community
I’ve never yet met anyone who feels that they are paid more than they are worth.
We work in a capitalist and highly unfair society in which some essential workers are paid a pittance while other worthless-people are paid massively. Engineers have excellent opportunities for success and furtherment but, in my experience, tend to be risk averse and to many stay in jobs that have little potential.
Engineering remains a fun and profitable career. But the trend to reducing industrial production as the UK commits carbon dioxide based hari-kiri, will certainly reduce both opportunities and salaries in the near future. Fortunately engineers are numerate and good at applying logic so could convert to banking and insurance.
I overheard our young engineer talking and he gets a salary equivalent to minimum wage, and that’s disgusting.
With the term “Engineer” covering so many options, it is not really possible to say that all are under or over paid. My general view is that “Engineers” could be paid better, but I have no data to back up that gut feeling. What is clear is that “Engineers” are not considered as highly in the UK as they are in countries such as Germany, which is a great shame and may contribute to the salary rates.
It all depends on what you term is an Engineer. The institutes I believe term an Engineer as someone who is degree qualified, then the terms, Technician Engineer, Technician then Mechanic, all depending on qualification. If you are talking about the engineering sector of industry, you are not talking about engineers specifically. In real terms Engineers are not valued and because of the misconception as to what an engineer is, they are low paid for thier knowledge.
I wonder how many people who are posting on here actually have a good view of salaries in other professions? My own inexpert view is that all professions moan about their compensation. Engineers’ salaries are just like most professions: cherry pick and you will find both poorly rewarded and handsomely rewarded individuals. We live in a market based economy. It may not be fair, but if it’s not working for you, change career to turn yourself into a more valuable commodity. That way, you have no need to whinge and one by one, you will be helping your fellow Engineers by reducing the market supply.
Of course Engineers are underpaid! And I have the wage-slips to prove it.
Disposible income is how you judge your wealth, and what car you drive is as good an indication of disposable income as any.
Have a look around the car-park of most Engneering firms. An embarrassment of old heaps.
Compare that with the car parks of Banks, Medicine, Law….etc…etc.
All the time (some) engineers treat the job as a hobby, the situation will continue.
I’d love to see the situation change before I retire, but I’m not holding my breath.
They say your salary should reflect your level of responsibility (or so I’m told). I’m a Design Engineer. I design the products that the company sells in order to generate revenue to pay the inflated salaries of the seemingly endless list of managers, directors, VPs, etc. I ask you, is there a more responsible position? My pay packet says yes, there are lots.
It is interesting to note that the HSE are currently advertising for engineers. Electrical engineers are being offered up to £60167 but mechanical engineers are only being offered up to £54508. Why the difference?
If I were to take a guess it comes down to supply and demand. Generally more people are qualified as Mechanical than Electrical at the moment so a higher incentive is offered to the sparks.
Here in Italy who you call the so called ” highly considered engineers ” , called here ” Dottori Ingegneri ” ( Dott .Ing ) are paid in the measure of 1300-1400 Euros ( 1027.48 -1106.51 pounds ) a month !
Neil Bertram has it dead right above. I’m not sure what the threshold for the members of a group feeling underpaid making it a reality is- maybe 85%?
Anyway, the whole wingeing thing is as childish, naive and unconstructive as the Teachers’ repeated “You’ll never get decent teachers if you don’t pay more!”
“Oh, so you mean we haven’t got decent teachers now?”
“Well, no, that doesn’t apply to us, we’re brilliant, dedicated and we do it for the love of the job. We dont’ mind being underpaid. Well we do, but…damn ! They’ve broken the code! Help we’re being oppressed!”
Chance of this being accepted <1%
Engineer is a broad term covering many areas, mechanical, electrical, electronic are just three titles and when sub divided into individual categories creates many more engineers.
Engineers are underpaid compared to bankers for instance, without engineers nothing would be built, serviced, maintained, designed, or even created for industry to make its massive profits.
Now we have established engineers create we ask what the bankers contribute? compared to engineers its less than 1% of what engineers create so why are bankers paid so much?
In short they handle and create wealth from nothing and this is why the same families remain in banking for generations, they are the ones handling everything we measure by which is money, and this is why 97% of wealth is only paper wealth not backed by an asset other than pieces of paper. Consider that the Bank of England has sold gold certificates for more than the total amount of gold in the world and these certificates are only paper with no asset to back it up, walk into the BoE with your certificate and demand your bar of gold and you will be arrested. They cannot give you your asset as it doesn’t exist so what do you really own? just a piece of paper.
so, the full extent of the conn is becoming clearer and cleared to more and more well educated persons. But watch out: as soon as you ‘question’ them they will get you. You have to be even smarter. Banking families?Most made their first ‘money’ from shipping prize money -ancestors who ‘stole’ other nation’s ships and cargo. The difference between a merchant adventurer and a pirate? The first had a licence from the Monarch (who got a slice of the profits) to be the second! Any other modern group you could say has a similar approach? Answers on a post-card?
12 multiscilled Engineers at our factory were tested on electrical mechanical and pneumatics 2 passed at a very high level 4 failed ,all are on the same pay some should get more some should stay the same and some should be sacked. My last 4 days on their were 5 engineering managers and only 3 engineers top heavy.
Derek, would you mind rearranging your words and throwing-in some punctuation for good measure?
It doesn’t make any sense as it is…
BTW, found this, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Night_of_the_Sciences
Didn’t know where to put it, so put it here.
I was looking for the kids’ section in this magazine and couldn’t find it. So if we are looking for future engineers, where would we start looking? At the end of university?
I’m a bit old fashioned – a mechanic is someone who has finished an apprenticeship, an engineer needs to have finished university. You know how to hold a screwdriver? Fine, so does my 5 year old niece.
Back to the kids’ section. How about putting a kids section into every printed “engineer”? The magazine for mum and dad, the insert for the kids?
Ralf wrote “an engineer needs to have finished university”, which is probably true nowadays, though I’d argue it wasn’t the case when I started in Electronic design/development 45 years ago with just an HNC to my name.. working-class boys from council flats didn’t go to university in those days…..culturally, they just didn’t.
Far more important than an Engineer’s educational background is answering the question “can he/she do the job?”. Comparing one typical engineer-type with another and trying to work that out, then the one with a Digree might well get the job, but it’s certainly not the only way to judge. Ex-Apprentices become competant Engineers too, with all the associated issues of lifelong poverty.
I feel that, what universities and techs are teaching in engineering courses is more about handling time pressure, meeting deadlines and sticking to specification, rather than actual innovative engineering. I think you’ll find engineers who are “highly paid” are either associated with monetary roles or else they are experts in certain fields. What I have learned is that you will not find out how to be an expert through finishing a degree, that takes a certain person with a passion for one engineering aspect who can propel themselves forward in their career through sheer expertise..
Also, I have found that companies are labeling roles as “engineers”, when they are far from that. I am currently employed as a “design engineer” but I mostly provide sales quotation to customers. So my role is more or less technical sales. This is maybe companies not understanding fully the role of engineers, leading to misleading salaries and responsibilities..